Church Planter Interviews – Jason Malec
Bob Hyatt
October 27, 2010

So your church, New Denver , is obviously in Denver, CO. Tell us a little bit about where you guys are planting in the city.

Well Denver has 2.5 million people, but it still has the feel of a small city. It’s pretty young, very transient. People don’t come here to commit, they come here to play. It’s like an adult playground. The people are highly-relational, distrusting of institutions and highly secular.

Our church is located in a semi-urban place, about 3 miles outside the urban core. We’re in the first ring of suburbs that were built when the city first expanded. It’s actually kind of funny, the place where my family live is about 2 miles away from the city and originally it was where people in the city would build country homes to escape the city…2 miles away!

Anyways, we are located where people are fairly wealthy, want the amenities of the urban setting without the messiness, grunge or “riff-raff” of the city.

People tend to be fickle, have a hard time committing and are always looking for something better to do at the last minute. They really like to keep their options open.

Tell us about the process you used for planting your church. What did that time look like? What did you do?

Well my family came with 2 other families, we were all on staff at a church in Atlanta. The 3 of us are co-pastoring the church together (which we know is a little unique. I like to say, “Co-pastoring isn’t the way to do it, it’s just that it’s the way for us.” For whatever reason, it works really well for us). Before we moved here we probably visited the city once a month for about 6 months. During that time we just worked at building relationships. Psychographics. Figuring out where we wanted to live and plant.

I was actually the last of the families to get there; we arrived 6 months after the other two families. When I got there we already had a core of about 20-25 people and we started small groups.

How did you build that core team? I’m always interested how people gather core teams when they are “parachuting” into another city they haven’t lived in for very long.

I’d say about 25% simply came from networking. We were constantly meeting with people and “pressing the flesh.” Another 50% came because they were familiar with North Point or were transplants from Atlanta and had attended North Point in the past. And the other 25% came from Facebook microtargeting. We’ve actually had a lot of success with that.
But getting back to the question about how we started…we took this core group of people and developed weekly small groups, and in March of 2009, we started bringing these small groups together once a month for some very light worship and then on October 4 of 2009 we began our semi-weekly worship service.

Obviously the focus of this blog is more towards the missional church and looking at different church structures. What is the structure of your church? What would the average month look like?

Honestly, it’s very much like your average evangelical church. This Fall we will have 4 weekly Sunday gatherings and have a few small groups distributed around the city and we’re looking at starting a Huddle and seeing how that goes. Maybe start a Missional Community? I guess we’ll see. We also have informal gatherings. I’ve tried to really tap those who are strong people-gatherers and have asked them to be proactive in getting people together to do fun things. Just trying to make it organic.

So as you think about the last 12 months of planting, what do you think worked really well?

That’s actually kind of a hard question to answer. I still feel like we’re caught in between our megachurch roots and the more missional, organic style.

We have certainly dug into our toolkit and can “put on” a good worship service. What we’re doing is pretty stripped down, though, but we feel good about it. One of our core group recently commented that she feels like she “can bring all of me” to our gatherings. And that was a big compliment. She meant that her doubts, questions, and earnest pursuit of God – whatever that looks like – was welcome. Again, that was very encouraging to hear.

But the best things have probably been the organic, relational connections. I think there’s been a lot of life in that. It really seems to tap into the reality that people in Denver are often anti-church, yet hyper-relational. So the relational connections tap into the vibe that you find around here.

In the last 12 months, what hasn’t worked?

You know, I think we were pretty idealistic at the beginning. I guess that’s normal for church planters, right?

Before we were here we had people tell us to expect 80% of the Core Team to vanish within a year or two. And of course we thought, “No, that won’t happen to us.” Yeah, it definitely did.

We also tried something for 6 months where we didn’t have a worship service once a month and encouraged everyone to get involved with a mission project we were all doing together. It seemed good on paper, but never quite got off the ground. We might have had 20% of the people come out on those Sundays. I’m glad we tried it and I know there’s actually another church in Denver that has had unbelievable success with that; it just didn’t work great for us.

What is one failure you experienced and what did you learn from it?

Some people might guess it’s been in the leadership aspect with three of us co-pastoring together, but that’s actually been great.

I think finding the right teaching rhythm has been hard with three of us. We tried to team teach the same message on one Sunday, that didn’t work. We alternated weeks, I taught for a week, then Stephen taught the next week, then Norton preached. Yeah, that didn’t work either.

Now we’re teaching for blocks of time, so I’m teaching for something like 4-5 weeks straight on one series. That seems to be working much better.

Ok. Let’s imagine it’s 365 days from now. What needs to be different in your community?

The key for me would be discipleship. We’ve got to disciple people. I just don’t know of many people who are doing this well. We’re looking to explore Huddles and that could really help, excited about that prospect.

We also really need to be sustainable. We’re top down right now and need to employ people who are evangelists and multiplying influence so we aren’t the only people carrying the banner. People are following right now and we need people who will lead with us.

What is the biggest thing God has been teaching you in the past year?

I think it would be easy for me to get caught up in creating a spiritual place for others. I think God is constantly reminding me that it starts with me. It’s the only way I can replicate anything, it has to start with me. One of the axioms we had in our last church that really stuck with us and gets to the heart of this: “Is what is happening here on staff worth exporting?”

So let’s think 5 years into the future. What does New Denver look like? What’s happened?

Man, 5 months from now would be awesome!

Well there are 3 of us on staff right now. I would think in 5 years we could have at least three networked churches, but maybe 6 or 8 that have spread and multiplied out of this (we can already see some of that starting to happen). Even now on a map of the city, it’s so interesting: There are three clusters of people with each cluster around where each one of us lives. And it’s not like we planned it like that, it’s just happened.

These interviews were originally published on Doug Paul’s blog: http://3dchurchplanter.wordpress.com/

By Bob Hyatt • October 7, 2026
“When God works in us nothing is useless, and nothing is spared.” - Jeannine Brown, Carla Dahl and Wendy Corbin Reuschling, Becoming Whole and Holy “There is no circumstance, no trouble, no testing, that can ever touch me until, first of all, it has gone past God and past Christ, right through to me. If it has come that far, it has come with great purpose, which I may not understand at the moment.” - Alan Redpath Here's something I've noticed about people as they get older: they tend to go one of two ways. They either get sweeter with age or they get crankier. They grow wiser and more like Jesus, or they grow bitter and more like the worst version of themselves. That's because life is formation. Everything we do and everything we go through shapes us one way or the other, mostly depending on how we respond to what happens to us, whether it's extraordinary or completely ordinary. Ministry works the same way. I've watched leaders come out of nearly identical trials in completely different shape. Some come out stronger. Others come out deeply wounded, discouraged, and ready to quit. The difference usually comes down to where they see God in the middle of the struggle, absent or present, and what questions they ask about it. Some ask, "God, why is this happening to me?" Others ask, "God, what could you want to form in me through this?" Both views of God will shape us, and so will both questions. They just shape us in very different directions. In my experience, the most common sin in church leadership is an obsession with numbers and results, paired with neglect of our own souls. On top of that, we rarely stop to notice how those numbers and results, and how ministry itself, are shaping us. So here's my suggestion: stop working so hard to develop your ministry and start noticing that your ministry is developing you. How you handle the realities of church leadership will determine not only what your church becomes but what you become. Leadership and ministry will form you. The only question is: into what? One tool God uses: the fishbowl Some people hesitate to become a pastor because it opens them up to scrutiny, and now and then to outright criticism. When I was a young leader, I hated the "fishbowl effect" of ministry. Everyone was watching me, and my mistakes seemed to count for a lot more than anyone else's. It felt deeply unfair that flaws that wouldn't even register at most people's jobs could cost me my job, my reputation, and my community. Never mind that maybe it bothered me so much because I had such a generous supply of those flaws. After years of living under the steady gaze of critics and cranks, I see the fishbowl differently. These days I actually welcome it. Richard Baxter, a Puritan pastor in the 1600s, put it this way: “While you are as lights set upon a hill, think not to lie hid... do your work as those that remember that the world looks on them... ready to make the worst of all... and to make faults where they cannot find them.”[1] Baxter understood that anyone who calls others to live like Jesus is going to get called out when they don't. His advice? Live like the world is watching, because it is. Some people in your life are ready to yell "Hypocrite!" at the first opportunity, to point out failings they share themselves, and, as Baxter says, even to invent faults when they can't find real ones. And Baxter's fishbowl had a few neighbors peering over the fence. Ours has a livestream, a comment section, and someone screenshotting the announcements. But Baxter goes further. He says we should be glad about it: “As you take yourselves for the lights of the churches, you may expect that men's eyes will be upon you. If other men may sin without observation, so cannot you. And you should thankfully consider how great a mercy this is, that you have so many eyes to watch over you, and so many ready to tell you of your faults; and thus have greater helps than others, at least for restraining you from sin. Though they may do it with a malicious mind, yet you have the advantage of it.” As a Pastor, you have more eyes on you and more people paying attention to how you live. That means you have more help than most in living well and avoiding sin. What some people mean for evil, God means for your good (Genesis 50:20). What looks like a downside of ministry turns out to be a path to maturity, to formation. In practical terms, living your life in front of others pushes you to do what you already know you should do. And it often keeps you out of things you might slide into if nobody were watching. One important caveat: embracing accountability isn't the same as tolerating abuse. Healthy scrutiny sharpens you. A congregant who attacks your spouse or treats your kids like church property is a different problem, and it calls for boundaries, not gratitude. Let's be clear, though: the fishbowl isn't enough on its own. What we're really after is internal: character, a changed heart. But knowing we're living out loud in front of a watching church and a watching world gives us structure, and that structure can help us build the habits and rhythms of holiness we want. As we try to let the heart and character of Christ take deeper root in us, we have the advantage of lots of eyes around us "encouraging" us to stay on the straight and narrow. My sense is that people who embrace this find that, over time, what starts on the outside moves more and more to the inside. Slowly, the choices we make because others are watching become, through habit, real character. Because I know people are watching, I think twice about what I say in public, what I scroll past on my phone, and how I talk to my kids at church or out on the sidewalk in front of the neighbors. More and more, those choices, first made because of an audience, become part of who I am. That's especially true when I treat those moments as kairos [2] moments: times when God breaks in and uses my awareness of a watching world to show me the character He wants to form in me and the choices He'd like me to make. But what if we don't embrace it? What about those who get shipwrecked by moral failure, character flaws, and private sins gone public? People who resent the fishbowl of ministry and the Christian life often end up living one way in public and another in private. It's as if their anger at being scrutinized pushes them into a divided life: they'll play by the rules in public but insist on their own rules in private. Frustrated with the audience around them, so eager to find fault, they forget the true Audience they live before. And as we've all seen from too many spectacular crash-and-burns, the fallout is often devastating. Families, churches, and the reputation of the whole Church take serious damage. Pastors, recognize that your formation is happening, one way or another… and make peace with the fishbowl. It's going to be there whether you like it or not. If you embrace it, you may find it spurring you on toward love and good deeds (Hebrews 10:24) and keeping you clear of the sins that have taken down so many in ministry before you. “You should thankfully consider how great a mercy this is, that you have so many eyes to watch over you.” Let the Holy Spirit use your public life, and every eye watching it, to shape and form you. The fishbowl and the formation of a life in ministry are coming either way. Let them help answer the question: into what? To further explore your own formation through ministry, join us at the Multiply Summit with special guest Rich Villodas this coming February in the Washington, D.C. area! Adapted from Eldership and the Mission of God by Bob Hyatt and J.R. Briggs. [1] Richard Baxter, The Reformed Pastor, London, 1657, p. 21. [2] Kairos is one of the Greek words for time, but it's different from chronos. Chronos is linear, calendar time. Kairos refers to significant moments full of possibility. Here, it means those times when God steps into chronos.
By Bob Hyatt • April 13, 2026
Here's a message from Ecclesia Pastor Aaron Graham